CKLW question [even though it's not in the Cleveland market]

RadioInsight Community Forums Midwest Cleveland CKLW question [even though it's not in the Cleveland market]

The login box issue should be resolved. If you are still having issues you can still use the alternate link, but please inform us so we can investigate.

This topic contains 48 replies, has 17 voices, and was last updated by  thenetwork 13 hours, 26 minutes ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 49 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #185133

    NuRoo2
    Participant

    ^^ I meant “MSA” instead of PSA.  Also, I’m not familiar with how much larger the TSA was than the MSA in Cleveland.  Maybe there it was mostly adding in Akron/Canton??

    #185142

    michael p
    Participant

    My issue with the CRTC is not that they wanted CKLW to be Canadian-focused, but how bent they are on keeping the signal out of the U.S. (again, fat chance, it’s going to be heard here) and as a non-factor in the Detroit market. Anything on that count would be a bonus for CKLW, IMO.

    What keeps CKLW “out of the U.S. is the current programming.  Are Canadians interested in what CKLW is broadcasting? It sounds awfully boring.
    The last time I drove to Detroit (almost 6 years ago) I tried listening to CKWW 560 while driving along I-75.  There was a constant line buzz in their signal.  As close to Windsor as the “down river” portion of Eastern Michigan is, you would have thought a signal of any wattage would have come through cleanly from just across the river.
    #185144

    Eric Jon Magnuson
    Participant
    Are Canadians interested in what CKLW is broadcasting? It sounds awfully boring.

    As was mentioned earlier in the thread, CKLW is easily the current leader in the Windsor metro–with a 17.7-percent share, in the Fall 2018 ratings (at http://assets.numeris.ca/Downloads/2018_Fall_Radio_DI_TopLineReports.pdf).  In second place is the local CBC Radio One outlet (CBEW), with less than half of that (7.4 percent).  That’s been a pretty-consistent result–even though Windsor is one of the metros that Numeris is now unable to measure more than once a year.  Also, it may not hurt that Bell now owns TV in the market (specifically, CHWI, a CTV 2 outlet).

     

    #185146

    Crazy Monkey
    Participant

    Speaking of Canadian AMs, I can recall 1010 CFRB Toronto being a regular here at night.  Now I hardly hear it.  I wonder if at some point they did the same thing as CKLW and created more null into the US.  Now at night, I often hear 1010 WINS instead.

    #185153

    borderblaster
    Participant

    CKLW’s day pattern is the same now as it was in the glory years, though electrical noise certainly takes its toll these days. Where I grew up in Western Ohio, (in the “triangle” between Fort Wayne, Dayton and Lima, we had a strong daytime signal and I first discovered The Big 8 (and the Motown Sound), blasting out of the speakers at our local park and pool. Nighttime was a different story, that strong lobe to their southwest dissapeared (this was to protect the Mexican clear, which was and is XEROK. Add Trans World Radio’s 525,000 watt blaster from the Caribbean and, though the night-time Big 8 was a staple all over the east and parts of the midwest, we had to DX WLS, WCFL, WABC et al for our hit fix at night. I remember CKLW’s day pattern pooped out between Akron and Canton, just north of Columbus and about the I-75/I-70 intersection north of Dayton.

     

    When we went on vacation to Western Michigan, I had the opposite issue…no daytime reception but a strong signal at night. Those vacation weeks were my only chance to hear the all night jock.  As far as any pattern shift, if anything they may have tweaked it slightly more straight east instead of sagging a bit southeast. The pattern info is here: https://fccdata.org/?lang=en&facid=98868&appid=305450&tabs=55064

    #185154

    borderblaster
    Participant
    I’m thinking some of the “number one in Cleveland” is urban legend. They’d have had a really good signal on the western lakeshore. Rest of the city probably not so much.

    Yekimi wrote: [As an aside, my sister and I used to fight over what station to listen to, she preferred CKLW, I preferred the local stations. With only one radio in the house, the battles were sometimes intense.] Do you recall what drove your respective preferences? When I used to drive from Columbus to the University of Michigan in Ann Arbor in the 70s, CKLW would go from pretty-much non-listenable to booming by the time I got just 40 miles or so north of Columbus on US 23, between Delaware and Marion. I recall how they always used to include Cleveland in temperature checks (at least during the 20-20 news). Does anyone know what kind of ratings CKLW got in Cleveland? Weren’t they also the dominant Top 40 in Toledo at one point?

    #185155

    borderblaster
    Participant
    There have been no substantive changes to the pattern since the 60s. They did re-do the towers about 2003 or so, and had a transmitter fire last year. CKLW, by the way, is doing what everyone on these boards claim they want; local programming and local news.

    My issue with the CRTC is not that they wanted CKLW to be Canadian-focused, but how bent they are on keeping the signal out of the U.S. (again, fat chance, it’s going to be heard here) and as a non-factor in the Detroit market. Anything on that count would be a bonus for CKLW, IMO.

    What keeps CKLW “out of the U.S. is the current programming. Are Canadians interested in what CKLW is broadcasting? It sounds awfully boring.
    The last time I drove to Detroit (almost 6 years ago) I tried listening to CKWW 560 while driving along I-75. There was a constant line buzz in their signal. As close to Windsor as the “down river” portion of Eastern Michigan is, you would have thought a signal of any wattage would have come through cleanly from just across the river.
    #185156

    John Basalla
    Participant

    Living in Berea, Ohio, CKLW came in loud and clear day and night, on any and all radios I had during the late 1960s and 1970s.  I used to listen to their Top 30 countdown show every week.  I think it was on Monday’s at 6:00pm.

    Some “Big 8” songs that appeared to be exclusive to them included “Co-Co” by Sweet (the group that later gave us the big Bubble-gummy hit “Little Willy”), “Awaiting On You All” by a Detroit Rock group I recall as Silverhorse.  The song was a cover of an album track by George Harrison.  “Funky Music Sho Nuff Turns Me On” by Edwin Starr (A powerfully rocking Motown disc that was wild bliss), “For Better or Worse” by the Canadian band The Bells, one of the follow-ups to their mega-hit “Stay Awhile”.  Of course, there were more.

    #185176

    Yekimi
    Participant

    For what it;s worth, last couple of nights CKLW has been coming in pretty decently. Maybe one of their engineers read this board and tweaked the signal! ;-P . Also, wonder how many Canadian artists got their big break in the USA from having their music heard in the states over the CKLW airwaves?

    #185182

    dannykewl
    Participant

    I miss that station, I was a teen in it’s hey day. The great mix of Motown and other pop hits, plus Canadian artists. Their 20/20 news which got pretty graphic. No holds on describing murders or other bad events. By 1970, the Canadian “FCC” mandated that 30% of the tunes played must be from Canadian artists. Yes, was #1 in 1970 for the 12+ Cleveland area demo. Everyone was listening to the Big 8 then, even though many listeners were station switchers, maybe to WIXY-1260, then back to CKLW. They indeed gave the current temperature in Toledo and Cleveland, and sometimes Erie, PA. Their signal hugged the North Coast all the way to Buffalo, NY. Could get them in the Catskills real strong at night, but nothing during the day. If you went west of Detroit, even Ann Arbor, would notice it fading. Their signal was purposely honed in on “The North Coast” at the expense of everyone else, Cleveland with it’s 2.5M metro area. Their signal is much weaker here in Cleveland now, as they are now a Canadian station aimed at Canadian audiences and topics. I wouldn’t doubt they moved Cleveland’s strong pattern up a few degrees in latitude to reach the stretch of Ontario between Windsor and Toronto, nulling what goes just south of that into the USA. They are now much weaker than WJR, at one time pretty much equal, but I think WJR always had the edge in signal over CKLW even back in the day. I don’t think WJR quite even puts out what they used to in our direction.

    The DVD some were talking about is called “Radio Revolution: The Rise and Fall of the Big 8”, been out a good 10 years now at least, excellent, can get at least snippets of it on YouTube, but I’m sure I watched the full documentary there at one time.

    #185187

    John Basalla
    Participant

    I think the “Canadian Content” rule didn’t only mean Canadian artists.  Composed by, produced by, recorded in Canada, (and maybe more), all would work towards fulfillment of the 30% (or whatever it was) content requirement.  Thanks to it, we heard things like the 3 big Canadian hits by Keith Hampshire.

    #185190

    phil z
    Participant

    In the Early 70’s  I  Drove a Truck Through Out Northwestern Pa. (Erie to Waynesburg and  towns that butted against  Ohio ). In the Erie area CKLW was strong,  Hills Department  stores were Starting and one of our stops they Also Advertised on the Big 8 I Remember Hearing locations of their stores in Ohio.

    #185196

    Charles Everett
    Participant

    The OP asked “whatever happened to 800”? Back in “the good old days”, there were no stations in the continental US on 800 at night because that was a Mexican clear channel. The WARC 79 treaty broke up the clear channels, allowing stations on 800 in the Lower 48 to go full-time. As a result the 800 in West Virginia now has flea power at night and the 800 in New Jersey upgraded to 500 watts at night.

    AM 800 in Windsor has always had to protect other stations on and adjacent, including 800 in Belleville and Montreal, 790 in Saginaw, 780 in Chicago. If there’s a weaker signal for AM 800 in Cleveland and Akron, it’s because the patterns were tightened to put less groundwave toward northeast Ohio. That happened around 1980 or so. AM 800 hasn’t directly gone for a US audience for at least 20-25 years and, given the state of things on both sides of the border, isn’t likely to do so now.

    By the way, CanCon didn’t kill “The Big 8”. Rock and Pop on FM did, whether in Detroit, Toledo, or especially Cleveland.

    #185198

    Nathan Obral
    Participant

    CKLW still thrived into the 1970s even with CanCon (and arguably gave the Guess Who, Gordon Lightfoot and Anne Murray their big breaks) and into the 1980s with Dick Purtan in morning drive. They were able to get past those restrictions and stayed viable longer than most Top 40 AMs not named WLS or CHUM.

    Recorded in Ultra Stereo, the ultimately superior cousin to Normal Stereo!

    #185207

    schmave
    Participant

    I miss that station, I was a teen in it’s hey day. The great mix of Motown and other pop hits, plus Canadian artists. Their 20/20 news which got pretty graphic. No holds on describing murders or other bad events. By 1970, the Canadian “FCC” mandated that 30% of the tunes played must be from Canadian artists. Yes, was #1 in 1970 for the 12+ Cleveland area demo. Everyone was listening to the Big 8 then, even though many listeners were station switchers, maybe to WIXY-1260, then back to CKLW. They indeed gave the current temperature in Toledo and Cleveland, and sometimes Erie, PA. Their signal hugged the North Coast all the way to Buffalo, NY. Could get them in the Catskills real strong at night, but nothing during the day. If you went west of Detroit, even Ann Arbor, would notice it fading. Their signal was purposely honed in on “The North Coast” at the expense of everyone else, Cleveland with it’s 2.5M metro area. Their signal is much weaker here in Cleveland now, as they are now a Canadian station aimed at Canadian audiences and topics. I wouldn’t doubt they moved Cleveland’s strong pattern up a few degrees in latitude to reach the stretch of Ontario between Windsor and Toronto, nulling what goes just south of that into the USA. They are now much weaker than WJR, at one time pretty much equal, but I think WJR always had the edge in signal over CKLW even back in the day. I don’t think WJR quite even puts out what they used to in our direction. The DVD some were talking about is called “Radio Revolution: The Rise and Fall of the Big 8”, been out a good 10 years now at least, excellent, can get at least snippets of it on YouTube, but I’m sure I watched the full documentary there at one time.

    WJR is omnidirectional, so that issue in Cleveland might be a result of ground system maintenance or even man-made interference locally. I personally have continued to notice a strong signal in that part of the state, even up to Conneaut where my in-laws live as mentioned earlier (and where both WJR and CKLW are quite listenable at all hours), but I will add that here in Columbus, WJR does not come in nearly as well as it used to. Get an hour or so north and it’s a solid signal, but here in town, it has seemed considerably weaker than it did even 20 years ago.
    Last time I was in Toledo, WJR and CKLW both sounded great as usual. The latter still is very listenable at night even with less signal aimed in that direction.
    • This reply was modified 3 days, 11 hours ago by  schmave.
Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 49 total)

You must be logged in to reply to this topic.

css.php